Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban: Ch 14-18

[00:00:00] Also the Dementor thing with the fog, it's been so foggy these last two days and it's a little nasty. I know, it's gross. I can't see it the same. You're walking around and... Yeah, I can't ever see it the same way.

[00:00:16] I know, it's disgusting, it's so gross. But this is a warm fog. Which makes it worse probably. Why is that worse? I don't know, I feel like a warm fog just feels grosser than a cold fog. But Dementors are cold fog, right? Because they're cold.

[00:00:41] Ever since Harry Potter, I've never looked at fog the same way. If it's foggy outside, usually I'm like, oh, that's cool. Now I'm like, ew. That's gross. It's true. The only thing that Harry Potter will wreck in your life is your appreciation for fog.

[00:01:04] Welcome to the podcast, I'm Jon. And I'm Lizzie. And this is Harry Potter and the Second Time Reader. Alright, we are going over four chapters of this podcast. And we're starting with Snape's grudge. Didn't we just do that? No! We just did Gryffindor vs Ravenclaw.

[00:01:33] We did talk about Snape's grudge. Can you give me a quick summary of Snape's grudge, if you remember it? Snape's got a grudge. Somebody... Nailed it! I don't know. Like, I know these chapters, but I just don't prep enough to be able to summarize them.

[00:01:52] I'm not like writing a summary for everything. Do you do that? No. No, but do it now. That was a command. You do that. So, they join... So, they have a little bit of a download of information with Hagar at the beginning of this chapter.

[00:02:13] But then they learn how much Snape hates... Kind of why Snape hates James Potter. I like quizzing you on summaries. I've failed most of them. I did really good on the first book summaries, I think. Okay, can you just give me your opinions on Snape?

[00:02:32] You know, Snape's a weird guy. I feel like I kind of like him. I kind of don't like him. I think he's in general just more inclined to be a mean person. Which kind of negates his meanness to me, if I just say that's his personality.

[00:02:51] But, I don't know. I think there are people like that in the world. But I don't think it's nice that he's taking out on kids. That's never justified. Yeah, that's a little... And he needs to get over all of his high school troubles. Like, it's so past that.

[00:03:10] Like, you're taking it out on the second generation. Which is also crazy. But, I don't know. Like, I remember saying something that Snape has a moral compass. But it's just not like fully lined up. Do you think anything has happened in Snape's past where it's been traumatic?

[00:03:32] Where it's like caused him to remain in that state a little bit? The state of what? Of being a jerk. It's hard to like say nice words. I keep being like, um, jerk. You can say whatever you want. We'll keep this... We'll keep it within reason.

[00:03:55] We have one curse word per podcast. I think there's like, if you rate something PG-13, I think that means you're allowed one F-bomb in the movie or something. So everyone makes jokes about the Lord of the Rings. Where would the F-bomb be? He spits out the soup.

[00:04:14] He just like eats the soup. It's just like... No, I don't know. There has to be some like really good timed one. What's that scene where there's that really ugly orc at the giant gate? The mouth of Sauron. I feel like somewhere in that scene would be good

[00:04:34] because it's such like high tension. For real. He cuts off his head and he goes, I do not effing believe it. Snape's a bitch. That's all I have to say. That's literally all I have to say. I don't think you can ever justify Snape's actions.

[00:05:03] But I'm going to justify his actions. I don't think you can ever justify what he does to kids, but I think that he's deeply immature. Not by his own doing, but I was talking to a therapist about this

[00:05:18] and I have to deal with some people with personality disorders and stuff like that. And someone talked about, or she was talking about what multiple personality disorder, what she actually thinks it is rather than what it's typically diagnosed as. And she says she thinks multiple personality disorder

[00:05:33] is rather just a trauma response, which a lot of the personality disorders kind of are. But she says multiple personality disorder is a trauma response and it's not like you have multiple personalities and they're all like vying for each other on your shoulders or whatever,

[00:05:46] which is what a lot of people think of that is. She says it's more like you were abused when you were a kid or something really traumatic happened when you were a kid and you stopped maturing from that point on. But all the maturing that you are experiencing

[00:06:00] is still maturing, but it's like you resort back to that childhood state every once in a while. And she's like, that's what I see with a personality disorder, a multiple personality disorder a little bit more than like, it's like a trauma response. So every time you happen...

[00:06:14] So like Snape is bullied in school. And so what do bullies do? They bully other people. And I think when he's bullying other people, I don't think he has multiple personality disorder because this is just his personality. You don't see like two different personalities.

[00:06:29] He's just a jerk to students, which is just not cool. So I think he constantly... The only thing that I will say for Snape in this chapter or in this whole book is I think there have been atrocities in his past that have kept him from maturing emotionally.

[00:06:51] Not that it's an excuse at all. That should never be an excuse because other characters, they have traumatic things that happen and they still mature. Harry has a ton of traumatic things and he matures incredible ways. But I just don't think Snape matured in any way

[00:07:05] from when he was a high school kid to now, which is a little sad. Yeah. I definitely feel like he's very insecure and he's all like projecting that onto every person he's interacting with in any capacity. Do I get to read about these horrors in Snape's life? Yeah.

[00:07:27] Okay, so it comes later? Yeah, yeah. Okay, that's good. Yeah, I agree with you on that 100%. He's a jerk though. He's a little bitch. Yeah, that's literally all I have to say about him. Like every time. I'm just like, can I curse on you?

[00:07:53] Oh, and he refers to himself in this thing. What part is this? Snape is looking at the Marauder's Map with Harry and he's like, show yourself talking to the map. But then he goes, Professor Severus Snape, master of the school, commands you to yield the information you conceal.

[00:08:20] And I don't know, I don't like how he refers to himself as the master of the school because he's not. Yeah. Right? That's not like all the professors can just say that. But it is like a joke. What? Wait, that Snape is saying this?

[00:08:35] Snape is commanding the Marauder's Map. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Am I missing something? No, because I don't know why, but in my head, I thought that line was the Marauder's. We're saying it to Snape as the masters of the school. No, but he refers to himself as that.

[00:08:51] What a loser. Yeah. Yeah, he's not. So he's just lying. Or he has some scheme to become the master of the school. Do you think he ever does become the master of the school? Probably for like a short time because doesn't McGonagall become? Yeah.

[00:09:15] Yeah, so I feel like maybe Snape has his moment, but then McGonagall would have to be dead or incapacitated, unable to serve. And I don't think Snape would do that to her. You know what else I think that, I think Hagrid and McGonagall are in love. Whoa. Yeah.

[00:09:37] I forget. Excuse me? I come to this in the book. If I remember, I will point it out. But there's like two instances now where they're having like these funny interactions. And I'm like, I think Hagrid doesn't like McGonagall,

[00:09:54] but I think McGonagall has a big crush on Hagrid. What? Yeah, that's what I'm gathering. First book I remember. Sorry, I'm going on all kinds of tangents tonight. I need you to go ahead as many times as you want, because these tangents are the best part.

[00:10:12] So first book, Harry's like just entering Hogwarts. Yeah. And maybe first book, maybe second, I don't know. But he's like, there's this little line and it says something like, he was shocked that McGonagall was actually laughing at Hagrid's jokes. And I was like, that is so funny

[00:10:31] because McGonagall is so serious. And Hagrid's like off the wall, goofy, like borderline just dumb. But like she's actually laughing. And that's such a thing where like you laugh so much harder at someone's jokes, even if they're not funny because you like them.

[00:10:45] And I was like, if McGonagall is down bad for Hagrid, that would just be so funny. Because I could totally see that where she's so serious and then there's just like something about Hagrid that she just was like, I don't know. That is so funny.

[00:11:00] I know a bunch of people like get together at the end, but I don't remember if that was one of them or if she does with anybody. But that's like my dream right now. Like, I don't even know if they're like the same age. But...

[00:11:14] They're actually kind of close to the same age. Isn't that great? I like am holding out so much hope for this. There's probably some fanfic or something out there. 100%. There's all sorts of smut out there. They're actually somewhat close in age too. This is great. Wait, how old? 60.

[00:11:35] Hagrid is about 60. And the guess on McGonagall is like 55 to 65. That's perfect. I know. Oh my gosh. Can you imagine? McGonagall, you don't know this backstory in the books, but she is a widower. She did have a husband. Husband died. I think of Dragon Pox. She's a widower.

[00:11:59] That's sad. I know. Maybe she's looking for love and found Hagrid. Yeah. Looking for love in all the wrong places. It's perfect. But then there was something in this book too that made me think of it. And I can't remember. But if I find it...

[00:12:13] If you find that, you have to point that out. Because now I'm going to be on the search for that now. Any good little tidbits between them two. That's a great theory. I love that. How would that work? That's a real question. What do you mean?

[00:12:31] Hagrid's a quite huge, large man. Oh my gosh. There's lots of debate about this question. Hagrid, do you know what Hagrid is? Hagrid's a giant. Or a half a giant. A half giant. Yeah. His father was a normal wizard and his mother was a giant. Giants are huge.

[00:12:56] McGonagall can handle it. Oh. I love that you said that. They're old anyway. Headcanon from you. Stop it. You go, they're old anyway. They're like 60. They can just be happy. Okay? Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Is that what you meant?

[00:13:27] Like is that what you were getting at? Yeah. There's lots of debate in the Harry Potter community about how that actually happened between Hagrid's father and mother. Because they say if it was reversed, if Hagrid's father was a giant and the mother was, people

[00:13:41] would say there would be a murder that happened. Can't you use some charms? Yes, they definitely could just like use magic. 100% that's what they're doing, they're using magic. I never thought about that but now that makes so much sense. Yeah. I can't believe you brought that up. Freak.

[00:14:07] I know. Wait, so his mom is a normal wizard? No, his mom is a giant and his dad is a normal wizard. Takes a dive in there. Stop. Yeah, I feel like it's okay. Like they can work it out. Yeah, yeah, they'll figure it out. There's magic involved.

[00:14:31] It had to have been done before. I love the theory of McGonagall and Hagrid though. That's becoming new headcanon for me. That's cute. I'll find the other part. Yeah, if you ever find that, you gotta bring it up. Anything else in chapter 14 in Snape's grudge?

[00:14:56] Let me revisit my notes. So Lupin does steal the Marauder's Map at the end here and he says this one devastating line. Your parents gave their lives to keep you alive, Harry. A poor way to repay them. By gambling their sacrifice for a bag of magic tricks.

[00:15:11] Which is a devastating one coming from Lupin especially. Alright, what is a summary of chapter 15? The Quidditch final. Quidditch final is happening. Your summaries are getting so good. Thank you. It's basically all about Quidditch. Everybody's super into it. It's very intense compared to the other Quidditch rounds.

[00:15:45] And then... They won the Quidditch Cup. Gryffindor won the Quidditch Cup. Yes, such a great moment. So far I have three favorite ending lines and this chapter is one of them. What was the ending line of this one? If only there had been a Dementor around.

[00:16:07] As a sobbing wood passed Harry the cup, as he lifted it into the air, Harry felt he could have produced the world's best Patronus. And it's so sad too at the same time because he's only seeing his happiness as it's useful to the dark.

[00:16:25] You know what I mean? He can't even have this shining happiness without seeing it in light of the darkness. Which is kind of an oxymoron but you get what I'm trying to say. No, that makes so much sense.

[00:16:36] That has made me think about Harry in a different light now. He is only thinking of utility rather than just being happy for the sake of being happy. That's a great thought. Lizzie, you are bringing out crazy stuff about Harry that I've never thought of before. Great.

[00:16:54] He's just pocketing this for further use to fight the darkness. That is so sad. Because he's only had a few happiness things. Only a few happiness things. But that's one of my favorite ending lines. What are your other two favorite endings? That serious black.

[00:17:15] And the book one about friendship? What? Bummer, never mind. Where Harry is thinking about... He likes Cho, right? And he's in his bed thinking about Cho and he put his face in his pillow and was happy that Ron couldn't see what he saw.

[00:17:32] And I was like, that's so cute. I love that line. But as of right now, those are my top three. Those are good ones. There's another prediction that happens in the beginning of this chapter. And she predicts that someone will leave the number forever.

[00:17:50] Which is clearly right because Hermione leaves their class later. And it's another prediction that even like everyone, this is like an obvious one. And it's a very generic prediction. But again, I think she's right in everything. Does anyone else leave? Just Hermione. There is a...

[00:18:12] Yeah, just Hermione leaves at this moment. Or not even at this moment, but she leaves later on. She drops the class. So again, yet another prediction that she gets right. I'll give you that one. I don't have anything to say to that. That's a pretty straightforward one.

[00:18:28] Yeah, this is so funny when they're in this class and they're all like goofing off and giggling. That is just so fun. I know. Like that's so relatable. I know for sure. Any other notes in this chapter? No, that was it. Those are my two thoughts.

[00:18:48] The last sentence. And that everyone is going crazy about Quidditch. I'm not gonna lie. Everyone is going crazy about Quidditch. It is a great chapter. I love good sports moments like that. So this is one of my favorite chapters for that reason.

[00:19:04] There's just like a fantastic sports moment here. And they're all so pumped and they're like, yeah, we won. It's just so good. I remember the first time I read this, I was like, every time Harry was nervous for Quidditch, I was like, please eat breakfast.

[00:19:18] Like, oh my gosh, you need to survive. You can't have an empty stomach. And I was just so nervous with him. And I was trying to watch out for him. But now I just, I don't know. I feel like you lose some of that. Yeah.

[00:19:33] I have lost a lot of like the being on the edge of my seat. But I'm still experiencing it in a lot of ways with the plot. Yeah. So because the little things, even like the time Turner second time around totally. I don't give it a second thought.

[00:19:49] Yeah. Like I'm completely confused by it still. Don't get me wrong. We'll talk about it. Just I like just know what to expect with that. You know, I think there's going to be more edge of your seat moments in the last three books.

[00:20:04] Because those are really where the series picks up a ton. The first three, I reread those and it's like, you know, you're not on the edge of your seat like a ton.

[00:20:11] But when I I'm like, you know, 10, 15 times through reading this and I still read last few books. And I'm still on the edge of my seat for some of them. Like there's a chapter that we just finished in the seventh book.

[00:20:24] And it is one of the creepiest chapters I've ever read. And it keeps me on the edge of my seat. So I'm like, I even though I know what's going to happen, you forget small little details here and there.

[00:20:33] But you're like, sheesh, like her writing is just exceptional. She just keeps you on the edge of your seat, even though you know what's happening. So it might come a little bit later for you. It might not at all. But yeah, I was blazing through them too.

[00:20:46] Yeah, for sure. I'm excited to like dissect. I know. And now we're going real slow. It's gonna be great. OK, the next chapter, chapter 16 is one of my favorites. Not really. But Professor Trelawney's prediction. So you remember this one? This is when she goes crazy. Yeah.

[00:21:08] And her eyes roll back and she kind of has like a weird seizure type of thing and says that somebody is joining the Dark Lord tonight at midnight. And Harry's just like, what? And then he's like, I think you're not OK. And then he leaves.

[00:21:28] But I would have been freaking out a little bit more than that. Yeah, I freaked out reading this. Like I don't even like that image of her, especially like in bug form, you know? Yeah, bug form.

[00:21:41] She goes rigid as a bug and then she just gives this weird prediction. But yeah, because I feel like she looks goofy in the movies. That from what you showed me. Yeah. The three images I saw. Like her glasses.

[00:21:56] She actually does do it pretty well in the movies. But then there's a brief moment of comedy right after. So it like takes you out of that.

[00:22:03] She gives this prediction and in the sound editing, they give her like, they like layer like her voice over each other like a few times. So it sounds really creepy.

[00:22:15] And as soon as the prediction is done, she realizes she's grabbing Harry and she goes, servant and master will be reunited once more. And then she goes, oh. And she like looks at Harry and she goes, sorry, my dear boy.

[00:22:31] And she like it's like a joke after that she was coughing and she just didn't even know where she was. She's a great actress, the best in this whole series.

[00:22:38] And she does pretty well with the scene, but it's a little it's not quite as like tense as the book. I think the book makes it a lot more tense than the movie. Yeah. But it's great. That one is not even up for debate. That's 100 percent real. What?

[00:22:56] Yeah, yeah. That's like the only thing that gives her any credence to me is like. Yeah. OK, so this will quiz your knowledge a little bit too.

[00:23:07] But at the end of this entire book, Dumbledore says or Harry admits that Professor Shalani had this like vision and Dumbledore says, oh, well, that ups her correct prediction count to two. Do you think that he's actually being like legitimate there?

[00:23:24] Is he just pulling out a number out of his butt? Is there is this the first one? Yeah, that's a real question. What's their first right prediction? According to Dumbledore. That Hagrid and McGonagall are in love. Imagine. I don't know.

[00:23:40] I think he's probably just busting her chops and he probably thinks she's got a little more in her than everybody thinks. OK, everybody thinks. I think he's kind of joking. But in the sense that he's taking her down for the joke and not like actually pretending.

[00:23:57] Yeah, I don't know. I could dig that. We'll see. We'll get there when we get there. Right predictions if he's just making up a number. We'll see. I do have one thing in this. Hermione's crying. But she's making tea in Hagrid's thing. Hey, Hagrid's house.

[00:24:23] As she picked up the milk bottle to pour some into the jug, she let out a shriek. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Hermione carried the milk jug over the table, turned it upside down. Scabbers comes out. So the real question is, does Hagrid have a fridge?

[00:24:35] Have we figured this out yet? Because clearly he has milk. And I remember you saying that like he didn't have a fridge. But. Well, because no, I didn't say he had it. I said he didn't have a fridge because in your depiction of it, he did. Right?

[00:24:54] I remember I gave like a. It's right next to the door on the right side. I love that. He might have a fridge. I feel like he's a little too. I feel like he would have a root cellar, but I don't know if he would have a fridge.

[00:25:07] Do they not show it in the movies? He has no fridge in the movies. At least I don't think. Where does the milk come from? You just I mean, like what do they do before they had fridges when they had milk?

[00:25:17] They would milk a cow and they'd put it up. It's probably fresh milk. Maybe he's going out milking the cows. But in a movie, Hermione is just like pulling this jug out of thin air. No, it's just on the like the shelves. That's so annoying. I love that.

[00:25:36] That's the one little thing in the shots where you're like, let's talk about the milk for a second. No thoughts. Just fridge. It could be. Maybe he has a fridge. I've never thought about Hagrid having a fridge. I feel like he is a bit too not nomadic.

[00:25:52] Nomadic is the wrong word. Like he lives like a rough life to have a fridge. Not a rough life. I don't even know what it's like. He's just an outdoorsman. Outdoorsmen don't need fridges. He's too rough for chilled milk. Yeah. Hagrid. Too rough for chilled milk.

[00:26:12] That's a great shirt, actually. Okay. That's funny. Yeah. And someone says they could use cooling charms. So maybe they're, but again, it's Hagrid. My theory again is that Hagrid is that Dumbledore mended Hagrid's wand. So Hagrid has his umbrella. So maybe he's using cooling charms on the milk.

[00:26:40] No way. Bad opinion. Wrong. So he has a fridge, but he doesn't, he can't use cooling charms. Yeah, for sure. All right. All right. We'll see. Anyways. And it is, I will say too that certain technology doesn't work at Hogwarts,

[00:27:01] but it is a little hazy because it depends on how you define technology. Because technology is really like everything. It's literally like everything is technology. Normal pens and paper. Yeah. Right. Like a quill is technology of some sort. Typewriter, I feel like they should have at least.

[00:27:21] I know. How much a ballpoint pen would save them? Imagine writing an essay and having to dip your quill in ink every single time, like after every sentence. That'd be ridiculous. Have you ever written with a quill? Really? Yeah.

[00:27:36] I've written with like a feather quill, but I've written with fabricated quills before, which are pretty cool. That's true because I've used calligraphy pens, but never a quill. Yeah. I'm not good at calligraphy. I want to see what you do. No, I'm not that good at it either.

[00:27:50] I just use it as like a quick form of writing that makes it look a little bit cooler. It's like embossed on the page. So I'm not great at it, but it's still just fun to do. I used to be better at it.

[00:28:00] I'm not that good at it. I'm not that good at it. I'm not that good at it. I used to really slow my handwriting and it was really good and it was like art form. But my one friend is exceptional at it. He's so good at it.

[00:28:14] He taught me. He's fantastic. I want to get a cursive tattoo. You should write it and I'll have your cursive font on there. No way. I don't want that. I don't want that responsibility. Just choose some random Microsoft font.

[00:28:30] Okay, if you're going to choose some random Microsoft font, then I'll write it for you rather than choosing something. You're going to write like comic sans. Yeah, forever and ever. We'll get a Harry Potter line tattooed after we finish the series.

[00:28:40] We'll do Harry Potter on one arm of a tattoo and we'll do Lord of the Rings when we finish Lord of the Rings series on the other arm. My brother has Lord of the Rings. Oh yeah? Yeah. What does he have? The sword. Oh, I want the sword.

[00:28:54] If I were to get a tattoo, I might get the sword. Yeah, it looks pretty sweet. It's the reforged sword, though it's not in pieces. Oh, I'll get the sword in pieces. Everybody gets it in pieces. Was that the actual sword? Yeah.

[00:29:08] Is that the end of the chapters section? No, we have one more chapter. So that was Trelawney's prediction. Anything else in that chapter before we go on to the last? Nope. Actually, I think we have... Hold on, maybe I misdid this. How many chapters are there? 22.

[00:29:28] We're going quick on this podcast, so let's do two more because we were at... One, two, three, four, five. If we stop at 17, then we'll have five for the next one. Okay. Cat, rat, and dog. 16. 14, 15, 16, 17, 18. We got to stop at 18. Why? Because we went... 14 was Snape's grudge.

[00:29:50] We started on Snape's grudge. 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, right? My math? I don't know. I'm just laughing at you counting on your fingers. You're better at math than me. So we did Snape's grudge till... We've only done three chapters on this podcast. Yeah, on this one.

[00:30:08] But I think this one's going quick, so I think we can knock out two more really quick. And the last podcast, we only do four. Okay. Because I think the last podcast will be a little bit more information, a little bit more discussion. Sounds good.

[00:30:18] But we'll see where we go in the next chapter. Okay, we're on chapter 17, which is the cat, rat, and dog. Can you give me a quick summary of this? Cat, rat, dog. So Harry gets dragged under the whomping willow. Yeah. And they meet... Wait, wait, wait, wait.

[00:30:42] Who gets dragged? Ron. That's what I said. I think you might have said that. I just didn't hear it. I'm not quizzing you on that. I said Harry for sure. Yeah, thank you for correcting me.

[00:30:58] And basically the trio is met with Sirius Black up there or down there. I don't know. And then Lupin comes, snapes under the invisibility cloak. And they kind of get a part of the story, but not really because it kind of ends with them talking about scabbers. Yeah.

[00:31:20] It's just kind of like an intro because this whole scene in the shrieking shack is really long. Yeah. It's really, really long. Do you not like that it's long? I am kind of with you. The pacing of these three chapters I think are okay.

[00:31:40] I think they could have been better, but I also think that it was a really annoying three chapters because they just would not spill the information that you needed. They kept... They were just circling it. And they were getting slowly closer and then finally they hit it.

[00:31:58] You're like, took you long enough. Yeah. I took so many questions with these chapters at the end. Yeah. First of all, Ron's leg is broken. And there's no way he's acting like this with a broken leg. He'd just be passed out from pain.

[00:32:15] It depends on the kind of break that you have. It says his leg was pointing out at an odd angle. Okay. That is a Sirius situation. That's a great point. Maybe Sirius was kind and gave him some numbing pain or something like that. I don't know.

[00:32:34] Or like the spell that was to numb the pain of it. Maybe Ron's just a badass. Maybe Ron's just... He has a high pain tolerance. He's high on adrenaline right now. Yeah, exactly. But okay, I still feel like Sirius is trying to kill Harry here.

[00:32:48] And I know he's not, but it's still so embedded in the writing that it really feels like Sirius is trying to kill Harry. And he's not explaining anything. And I know all the little lines of like, he should just be straight up and he's not.

[00:33:03] And I just, yeah, it kind of all bothers me a little bit. That's a fascinating point. I think she had to do that for the writing sake. You had to still be confused up until this point. And you didn't really know where things were going.

[00:33:14] So I think she was doing that for writing. But at the same time, I think that Sirius doesn't know how to interact and communicate with human beings at this point. He hasn't really talked to anybody.

[00:33:26] And then all of a sudden he's talking to this cat out of nowhere. So I think he doesn't know how to really communicate well the things that he's going through. So I think he's like, like his trauma response. This is laughing in the middle of this thing.

[00:33:40] Maybe it's the same thing. He's like he can't pick something to land on and he still looks like he wants to kill Harry because he is he's so bloodthirsty. I do think at this point, this too, like he's so bloodthirsty.

[00:33:52] He's been sitting on this for years, for like what? 11 years, 12 years, 13 years, actually. And he's been sitting on this thing for 13 years thinking about the day that he's going to get revenge. And I think it was enough to drive anyone loopy at the actual moment that it's happening.

[00:34:14] Like, doesn't matter who's in your path. You look like you want to kill everyone because you've been fixated on this one person. Yeah. But again, he doesn't do it quick enough, which is really interesting.

[00:34:24] Like if he's like playing with his food and I don't think someone who's been lingering for this long wants to play with their food. Playing with their food. That's such a good way of putting it. That's crazy.

[00:34:35] And it remember like the I was saying, I think in book two about like the Hallmark movie kind of confessional before you pull the trigger and like the truth comes out. Yeah. Like that kind of felt like this, but it was so extended.

[00:34:54] And then Lupin was trying to yeah, like Lupin was slowing this whole situation down because he just needed to say his whole thing. But Lupin didn't understand that either. Lupin was trying to piece together. That line where he's like, did you switch? Like unless da da da whatever.

[00:35:15] I read that line and then I read a page and then I read that line and then I went back and I read that line like 50 times like just going back and forth because I did not get what it was trying to say at first.

[00:35:26] And I think I was probably trying to piece it together a little too early because it does take a long time. But yeah, I read that line so many times. Because you wanted to know what they were talking about.

[00:35:37] Yeah. And it's really good. I like that mystery aspect of like you're really not revealing it. Like I do have to kind of work to figure out what you mean. That was nice. Thank you JK Rowling. So do you know what he meant by did you switch?

[00:35:52] So he was talking about Pettigrew. Yeah. And yeah, he's unless he was the one unless you switched without telling me. So I guess that makes sense why Black wouldn't say anything because the secret keeper, the whole thing is to be a secret.

[00:36:14] But I don't understand like why was Black doubting himself like that? It's a great question for what they were actually thinking when they were doing this. I think part of it as maybe bad an argument as this.

[00:36:31] This is I think part of it is to blame for they're still just young kids and a little immature and they don't really know what they're doing. Because most people say, why didn't they just let Dumbledore be the secret keeper?

[00:36:44] Nothing would have happened. It would have been awesome. It wouldn't perfect. James could have been the secret keeper, but then all of a sudden they give it to he gives it to Wormtail. A lot of questions why he actually did that.

[00:36:56] Most people chalk it up to him just being him trying to like change plans last minute because Sirius was the obvious choice for it.

[00:37:05] But they I kind of just think they should have given it to Lupin if you wanted to change it around, like maybe Lupin would have been the easiest and next in line.

[00:37:13] But it's like Pettigrew is the last person they would suspect, so they thought they would give it to him. It was just short sighted. It was foolish of them to do that.

[00:37:23] I still don't understand the whole backstory to the secret keeper thing, which I think is justified at this point in reading because I don't think they've given us the whole story.

[00:37:34] But Voldemort they know is after the Potters at this point, right? Like in this secret keeper making time. Yes, the Potters have been shacked up in their house for a few months. And Sirius is the secret keeper.

[00:37:52] And they've been shacked up and they haven't really been able to do anything or go anywhere because as long as they're there, they're safe. And the secret keeper doesn't give away the secret as soon as they switched.

[00:38:04] And as soon as Sirius gave it to Wormtail, Wormtail reported this to Voldemort and Voldemort could just walk in as easily as he wanted to and kill them. But Sirius was never a secret keeper. He was for a time. How do you just swap secret keepers?

[00:38:17] You let someone into the secret. I mean, that's actually a really good question. Swapping secret keepers rather than just letting someone into the secret. Because for another thing that we're going to talk about, you just tell someone the secret. Maybe I'm actually wrong about that.

[00:38:32] Because I thought he said something like I convinced them to not do it with me. But I still don't understand because they essentially knew it was a death wish to be the secret keeper because they knew Voldemort would be coming after them.

[00:38:46] Yeah, someone, one of our good fans says Sirius was never a secret keeper, I think. There's one thing that's going on in my head right now that is a little bit strange then. Is the Potters were in hiding for a long period of time.

[00:39:04] Can someone on stream answer me that? Can someone tell me why Voldemort wants to kill the Potters? I can't tell you that. That would really help. Okay, so Sirius was, yeah, Sirius was never a secret keeper.

[00:39:18] Because that's kind of the way this book depicts it. He lets the Potters choose Wormtail, but the Potters were in hiding for a long period of time. In hiding, but not under the Fidelius charm. Interesting. Can you explain that process? What, the Fidelius charm? Yeah.

[00:39:38] You can hide in like a house, like we'll talk about this more in the fifth book a little bit. But like your house will be completely hidden. No one will be able to enter until they have the secret.

[00:39:55] So the secret keeper, if they decide to give the secret to another person, then that person can enter the house. But the only person who can enter the house is a secret keeper. So it's like you trust someone. It's really like a protection charm.

[00:40:09] And there's a few other things that we'll talk about that within the fifth book, because the fifth book makes this a little bit more clear. But like there's a piece of paper in the fifth book that Harry reads and then he's given the secret to the location.

[00:40:22] So it's like, it's essentially like the address. So I think about it this way. They're only safe in the house? Yeah. Only truly safe in the house. They'd be safe like if they had their wands and they went for a walk, they wouldn't be safe.

[00:40:33] But they could like defend for themselves and like fight off Voldemort. But they don't want to fight off Voldemort because they know he's probably better than them.

[00:40:41] So they're just hiding away and they're staying safe because there's literally no way that Voldemort could get to them if they put their the secret keeper in the right person's hands. So they were just going to raise Harry in this house?

[00:40:56] They were just I guess they were just in hiding long enough that they were trying to see if Voldemort would be defeated and then they would come out hiding. And he's Voldemort at this point. He's not Tom Riddle. Yeah, he's Voldemort at this point. Interesting.

[00:41:13] Yeah. There's a lot of yeah, for these, especially these next two chapters, there's a lot of questions that just pop up in your head, but they're not completely answerable.

[00:41:23] I mean, they are answerable at this point, but you just don't fully grasp some of the stuff until it's revealed a little bit later. Like the Fidelius charm is definitely one of those where you don't completely understand it really until book five.

[00:41:34] And then you'll get it a little bit more in five and then it keeps giving you more information on it as book five goes on. So that's a good question. Because Sirius just reads us so much more trustworthy than Pettigrew. Yeah, Pettigrew is literally a rat.

[00:41:52] He's going to rat them out. Yes. Personified. I know. I get that. That annoys me. I think Pettigrew is perceived in the books a lot as like this dumb idiot.

[00:42:04] I think he was he was a weakling who was a lot smarter than we make out to be, because I think there's a pretty significant thing in being able to kind of like not necessarily dupe your friends like he didn't he wasn't duping his friends because he wasn't on the dark side the entire time.

[00:42:24] But there's a line in the books that talk about Pettigrew being he just attaches himself to the next strongest person. So at school, he saw the marauders, James, Lupin and Sirius as the strongest people that he could attach himself to.

[00:42:38] So he did that. And then as soon as Voldemort really rose to power and he was like, OK, this is this is where I'm going to be safe. So he only seeks his own safety and his own protection.

[00:42:47] So when they gave him the thing, they thought it was out of loyalty because he was their friend for so long. And then the friend betrayed them because really his motives are not about friendship and loyalty.

[00:42:58] They're about I need to be safe. It's about his own own skin. Yeah. Great question. Coming up with great questions here. I'm thinking too much to talk right now. But the whole thing of like even Sirius being so unclear in these chapters is a bit frustrating.

[00:43:17] Lupin coming in and they have to like rehash half the story is like a little bit annoying. Because Chapter 18 is essentially just a continuation of this chapter. So we won't even give a summary because this is just essentially the download of information of what they're talking about.

[00:43:32] Yeah. And Lupin does give more than Sirius for sure. Yeah. In terms of giving the story. But I hate when Ron says get away from me werewolf that late. I know that kind of hurts a little bit. Don't say the W word. That's how I felt.

[00:43:57] Do you think that Dumbledore is right to let Lupin come to the school as a werewolf? I don't know. Not just as a teacher werewolf, but as a student. Yeah, I think as a student it's fine because they're adults and they can like take care of it.

[00:44:13] Take care of him more. But just banishing him under this tree. It's a little wild. Imagine your mom being like you're going to go to school, but like they're just going to shove you under this tree. Once a month you're going to be shoved under this tree.

[00:44:29] Well, I mean this tree leads to the streaking shack. So for sure they kind of be safe. I don't know. It doesn't feel ideal, but it's way better than him not being able to go to wizarding school. Yeah, absolutely. So I'm for it for that reason.

[00:44:42] Because essentially he's just giving him an opportunity that he wouldn't otherwise have. So it's just not ideal. But that's why I can't be against it because otherwise he wouldn't really get to have a normal human experience at all. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:44:57] That's why I love that Dumbledore does it because it does humanize Lupin. And Lupin is like one of my favorite characters. But Dumbledore picks and chooses battles again, which is why your theory on Dumbledore being like a shifty dude is actually really interesting to me.

[00:45:12] He does because there's another werewolf. The werewolf that bit, I mean, you could say this on anybody. But there is, I guess there's like a predisposition and Dumbledore thinks he just knows these people so well. So he lets Lupin into the school.

[00:45:24] But Lupin is really the only werewolf I think we know that has been let into the school like this. Maybe there's been others that Dumbledore has trusted, but I'm sure there's other kids that have been bit.

[00:45:32] And that have come up and Dumbledore is like, no, no, this kid's like, you know, bad news. So he doesn't let them into the school for that reason. But he doesn't, he trusts certain people and not others.

[00:45:40] So I don't know, your theory on that is like starting to infect my mind. Did you not think of Dumbledore like that? No, I did, but I trust him a little bit more than you because I just know the end game so much. Yeah.

[00:46:02] So again, it is like the ends justify the means. It's like for the greater good kind of stuff. But Dumbledore does have that mindset a ton. But I just perceive him as like, you know, he's the wisest person in this book.

[00:46:15] So I just trust him even though he is definitely abusing the system and he's definitely just like, this is my own thing. But he's such an omniscient character in the books. I just can't help but trust him. He really takes control of the school.

[00:46:28] He's like, this is my school. I can do what I want. So I don't know. Neither here nor there. Yeah, I know. Are there any other questions in these chapters? Nope, I don't think so.

[00:46:44] We'll talk about this one next podcast too because the Servant of the Dark Lord is next and we'll ask some questions about that for the next podcast. Yeah, the next chapter is essentially the same. Yeah, I know. So we'll carry on next time.

[00:46:56] Thanks for joining us on our journey of Harry Potter and the Second Time Reader. Peace. See ya. Bye.