Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Ch 34

[00:00:00] , I mean, maybe just like a sad question to start, you know, because we, Colin Creepy

[00:00:06] dies this chapter where you learn about it.

[00:00:09] What, uh, what death has hit you guys the hardest chapter?

[00:00:12] Are we on three, four, four, four again?

[00:00:15] Okay.

[00:00:16] That's what I thought, but I didn't realize he was in this one.

[00:00:19] Yeah.

[00:00:20] So here you kind of just passes them by and Neville is holding him with Oliver would

[00:00:25] and that's how like he bumps into Neville there.

[00:00:28] But out of every death that's happened so far, which one has been the one that has hurt you

[00:00:33] guys the most or the hardest one?

[00:00:38] I laugh at all.

[00:00:43] You go first.

[00:00:47] Otherwise I'll cry.

[00:00:48] And I don't want to.

[00:00:51] It's OK.

[00:00:51] You can let it out.

[00:00:52] But apparently I stunted his tears.

[00:00:56] I would say Dumbledores was the hardest because it was actually time to grieve within the

[00:01:04] story.

[00:01:05] Yeah.

[00:01:07] But I think these deaths are just so much more shocking.

[00:01:12] They just happen and then they're gone.

[00:01:14] You're like, what?

[00:01:15] What just happened?

[00:01:16] And now we just have to go fight the dark lord.

[00:01:19] So Colin Creavy was intense because you just don't expect it.

[00:01:23] There's not even a battle happening at the moment.

[00:01:25] So then it's just like, I don't know.

[00:01:28] Wait, what's that phrase about the innocence being always the innocent to go?

[00:01:33] So it has been so it is now.

[00:01:36] There it is.

[00:01:37] I didn't even catch that.

[00:01:39] And then Colin Creavy to me, that feels like the perfect example of that

[00:01:44] because I think everyone else kind of knew what they were getting themselves into.

[00:01:47] But he's so young and innocent that

[00:01:51] his heart was in the right place.

[00:01:52] He was being intentional about it, but he was just too young to even know better.

[00:01:57] I don't know.

[00:01:58] It just feels like he was too young.

[00:02:01] It's crazy, like even Lupin and Tonks are just it's like a throwaway line

[00:02:05] that they're just bodies are just laying there.

[00:02:07] And so even in this chapter when Harry sees them again, when he, you know,

[00:02:10] resurrects them, they all look younger or Lupin at least because he's the

[00:02:14] only one there looks younger and he looks whole.

[00:02:17] And like that almost crushes you more.

[00:02:19] You're like, he Lupin.

[00:02:20] I mean, he wasn't like an old man, but he was he still was kind of young when he died.

[00:02:24] Yeah, all these people were pretty young.

[00:02:27] Dumbledore was the only one who wasn't really, really that young.

[00:02:30] But it's interesting too, because you guys were like happy when Snape died

[00:02:34] and then all of a sudden all this new information comes up and you're like,

[00:02:37] oh, man, that I don't know if it hurts, but it's like.

[00:02:40] Oh yeah, it does just because it leaves you confused.

[00:02:45] Like, could they have done something different or better?

[00:02:48] Or why did it happen like this?

[00:02:50] What if he had done this or told him then or wasn't so mean?

[00:02:54] Do we actually like him?

[00:02:56] I'm a little sad, but should I be?

[00:02:58] Yeah, yeah.

[00:02:59] So it just like leaves you with so many questions.

[00:03:02] You were always rooting for him.

[00:03:02] Except I think a rooted one he was being killed to to rewatch them.

[00:03:10] But I thought he would be redeemed before he died.

[00:03:13] I know.

[00:03:14] Yeah, that does think.

[00:03:15] So that was a little annoying.

[00:03:16] It was interesting because it was always in your brain.

[00:03:19] I feel like that Snape had the potential to be good.

[00:03:22] I remember one podcast we were talking and Danny was like, or I asked like

[00:03:26] because you guys still had hope for Snape.

[00:03:28] You're like, you know, Snape is still good before the fifth book,

[00:03:30] especially even before the sixth book, you're like, Snape is still good.

[00:03:32] And I was like, what could Snape do that would turn him

[00:03:36] and make you make him irredeemable in your eyes?

[00:03:39] And I think you mentioned like killing someone like a Danny was

[00:03:42] like if he killed someone, that's like the moment.

[00:03:44] And then as soon as he kills Dumbledore, Danny's is like, Danny's out.

[00:03:47] I was like, that's it.

[00:03:48] He's like, there's no excuse.

[00:03:51] And it's all because of that line of Dumbledore saying please.

[00:03:54] Yeah.

[00:03:57] So that was funny.

[00:03:58] Yeah, it really fools you with that one.

[00:04:00] Are you saying please kill me?

[00:04:02] Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[00:04:04] Like we discussed this, like do what we discussed, please.

[00:04:08] But we just took it the opposite way.

[00:04:10] Because that's what she's such a writer.

[00:04:13] Yeah, exactly.

[00:04:13] Until you know the ending, you're like he's he's saying please begging for his life.

[00:04:18] Where in reality, he's saying please begging for Snape to kill him.

[00:04:22] Yep.

[00:04:22] It's so good.

[00:04:23] It's always brings me back to the buck beak moment of the unmistakable

[00:04:28] thud, which was mistakable because it wasn't the thud of a beheading.

[00:04:34] Yeah, so it's just like another time where she like

[00:04:37] clearly led us somewhere and then there was a curve ball.

[00:04:40] Although time travel, who could have seen that one coming?

[00:04:43] But she's so interesting.

[00:04:46] Yeah, thanks in here.

[00:04:48] But wait, Jen, what what death was hardest for you?

[00:04:52] I already answered that.

[00:04:53] Weren't you paying attention?

[00:04:54] I guess not enough.

[00:04:58] Do I get a hint or I have to wait till the podcast comes out?

[00:05:01] I didn't say it.

[00:05:03] I'm going to say I missed it too.

[00:05:08] I don't know.

[00:05:09] I just said some stuff about Snape.

[00:05:13] Dumbledore was the shocking one, I think, though.

[00:05:18] I was maybe not the sad.

[00:05:19] I don't know.

[00:05:20] I don't know if that would kind of saddest, but most shocked.

[00:05:24] Yeah, I guess whatever like affected you most.

[00:05:26] It was like one of the main characters that we're going to defeat.

[00:05:30] A Voldemort. Yeah.

[00:05:34] But the other ones in Balrami has much.

[00:05:38] They should.

[00:05:40] It's interesting.

[00:05:41] I know it doesn't necessarily matter.

[00:05:43] I don't think they should or not.

[00:05:44] I think everyone like has this expectation, you know,

[00:05:47] a bunch of people who are reading for the first time,

[00:05:49] especially reading between the books,

[00:05:51] like you get to sit with the characters

[00:05:53] for all the time in between the books.

[00:05:54] So you have like all sorts of theories

[00:05:55] and like there's just a different emotional connection.

[00:05:58] But so true with most people who read them now, like

[00:06:01] they're not so devastated by, you know, one or two of the deaths.

[00:06:04] Like I know some people who when serious died,

[00:06:08] that was like the only one that they cared about.

[00:06:11] They were like love serious and when he's when he's dead,

[00:06:14] they didn't even want to read the books anymore

[00:06:15] because they're so devastated.

[00:06:17] But like like some of my family, they've read this

[00:06:19] and they're like there are certain parts where they get choked up.

[00:06:22] But I love hearing where everyone kind of gets choked up in the series

[00:06:27] and like deaths are just a natural one

[00:06:29] where like people get choked up at.

[00:06:30] But my brother read through the series

[00:06:31] and he got choked up at a totally different one.

[00:06:33] Not none of the deaths, but a totally different moment that's coming up.

[00:06:37] That's just like so good.

[00:06:38] That's great.

[00:06:40] It was so cute to hear him get choked up at that.

[00:06:43] But it's interesting that none of you

[00:06:45] you guys did not think that Harry

[00:06:49] was the most devastating death.

[00:06:51] So you don't do not think he's dead?

[00:06:54] No, I don't.

[00:06:55] Just saying I don't know enough.

[00:06:58] I'm holding my breath on that.

[00:06:59] And you know what?

[00:07:00] I think there needs to be conclusion before there could be grief.

[00:07:04] So for me, I'm like, did it?

[00:07:07] And she's too tricky about everything.

[00:07:08] So I'm waiting for there to be like some kind of something.

[00:07:13] So no, I do not think of him as dead yet.

[00:07:17] So we'll see. We'll see.

[00:07:19] Yeah, we'll see. Maybe we'll see.

[00:07:20] I don't know if I really process any of these deaths.

[00:07:24] I just read over.

[00:07:24] Yeah. Well, that's why it would be so crazy.

[00:07:27] You want an answer.

[00:07:30] I feel like between books with processing big deaths

[00:07:34] and having to wait for the next book gives you a lot of time to like grieve

[00:07:39] and think it over. Yeah.

[00:07:41] And then even just growing up with the characters,

[00:07:43] if you've read the books over years,

[00:07:45] it would mean the characters have been in your life for a longer period of time.

[00:07:49] So again, just the stunted reading experience.

[00:07:53] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:07:56] Well, welcome to the podcast.

[00:07:58] I'm John.

[00:07:59] Jen, Danny and Kristen.

[00:08:01] And this is Harry Potter and the First Time Readers.

[00:08:15] So I don't think this this chapter is going to be incredibly long,

[00:08:20] but we'll have a little discussion on this one

[00:08:22] and then we'll just kind of listen to the next one.

[00:08:24] They didn't tell theirs.

[00:08:26] Yeah. Hey, good point.

[00:08:28] Oh, are you or two?

[00:08:31] Oh.

[00:08:33] Most devastating up till now.

[00:08:35] Up till now. OK.

[00:08:37] Because Harry's still alive.

[00:08:38] Yeah.

[00:08:39] If only for another second.

[00:08:42] Because Harry's still alive.

[00:08:49] I think

[00:08:50] or is it different because you watch the movie first and then the book?

[00:08:54] Maybe.

[00:08:56] I feel like this time around serious was

[00:08:59] rough for me.

[00:09:02] I'm trying to remember so long ago.

[00:09:04] And now seriously.

[00:09:05] Yeah, like one was like a year and a half ago.

[00:09:08] Yeah.

[00:09:09] Probably a year.

[00:09:11] I don't know.

[00:09:12] I got to think about that.

[00:09:13] But maybe him.

[00:09:14] Each one hits me at different.

[00:09:15] Each read hits me at different times.

[00:09:17] I think the one this one this one

[00:09:19] that was maybe most affected was

[00:09:22] the Tonks and Lupin or

[00:09:25] Tonks and Lupin one

[00:09:26] because every single time I forget how much of a throwaway it is.

[00:09:30] And it's just so devastating,

[00:09:32] especially when you reread this

[00:09:35] like rereading the whole series,

[00:09:36] you'll see just some devastating things that she put in right before.

[00:09:44] Tonks right before this past is where they die.

[00:09:46] You have the whole idea that Tonks is essentially looking for Lupin.

[00:09:50] Yeah, like searching the castle for Lupin.

[00:09:52] And it's kind of like a microcosm of the relationship where they're like,

[00:09:55] they're not almost on.

[00:09:56] They're not really on the same page.

[00:09:57] And then finally they come together and then the end of their life.

[00:10:01] It's like they had such a short time together,

[00:10:03] which is just devastating.

[00:10:04] And like there was a lot of turmoil in the midst of it.

[00:10:06] And finally they were happy.

[00:10:07] They had a moment when they were happy.

[00:10:09] You know, they had the kid and it was so you're like,

[00:10:13] this is great.

[00:10:14] Finally some joy in this war that we haven't gotten an entire series.

[00:10:18] And then all of a sudden both of them are dead and it's devastating.

[00:10:21] So that one probably hit me the hardest for this one.

[00:10:23] I think it my first time reading you loved it.

[00:10:28] First time read, I think Fred was the hardest.

[00:10:31] That was one where I was devastated.

[00:10:33] You just love the twins in your first time.

[00:10:35] I mean, I mean, I was going to, but I thought you might so on to leave you

[00:10:42] at least one because I think he started off the deaths where then you're

[00:10:46] like, oh, this is real.

[00:10:47] It's happening now.

[00:10:48] This is not like a future battle.

[00:10:50] This is the battle.

[00:10:51] So I feel like that's why it really catches you with a left hook.

[00:10:55] I think if it was one of the three, like I said, including Harry.

[00:11:02] If it was like Ron or Hermione, that probably would have been rough up to now.

[00:11:07] Whatever that looks like.

[00:11:09] And we'll hit the movie deaths too when we actually do the next few movies.

[00:11:16] Those will probably cry so you get your tears.

[00:11:18] Honestly, they're pretty devastating.

[00:11:20] They they the Dumbledore death, they do change to some extent.

[00:11:25] And we'll talk about that a lot.

[00:11:29] They the Cedric death is really good in the movies.

[00:11:34] I was just going to say I forgot about that one.

[00:11:36] It's me.

[00:11:37] Yeah, it just comes out of nowhere.

[00:11:38] The Dobby death is really good.

[00:11:40] So I'm saying to the Dobby one is really good.

[00:11:42] I forgot about Dobby.

[00:11:43] Yeah, you're right.

[00:11:44] That one was sad.

[00:11:45] Yeah, that was a tough one.

[00:11:46] Yep.

[00:11:47] That's up there.

[00:11:50] It feels like so long ago.

[00:11:52] I know so much has happened since Dobby.

[00:11:56] It's because you always wait till like the end and then it's like bam, bam, bam, bam.

[00:12:01] Well, sorry.

[00:12:02] I'm not trying to.

[00:12:04] Well, maybe I am.

[00:12:06] I don't like world building.

[00:12:07] I just want to make fast.

[00:12:09] Just tell me this is a door.

[00:12:10] It's a funny reading experience.

[00:12:11] You're like just give me the freaking answer.

[00:12:13] And then it's like describing the forest or the building.

[00:12:17] I'm like, I could carry less.

[00:12:19] Like I just tell me what story.

[00:12:22] It was so funny during our library of the princess tail or the elder wand when

[00:12:29] Voldemort's like circling his prey.

[00:12:32] He's like, oh, you know, this is why the one doesn't work for me.

[00:12:36] And he just doesn't arrive at the point and Jen's like, will you just say

[00:12:39] what the heck the answer is?

[00:12:42] Like how many times are you going to say the same thing over and over again?

[00:12:45] I'm like, just stop.

[00:12:47] Like that doesn't, I don't know.

[00:12:48] I guess I'm not a reader because it doesn't work for me.

[00:12:51] Makes it so funny to me.

[00:12:54] But this is for a lot of you'll kind of get this as we go on through the

[00:12:59] last which is now the last three chapters just crazy.

[00:13:03] But I'm curious at the end of the series what you think is like the

[00:13:05] best chapter, the culmination of all the chapters because a lot of fans

[00:13:09] love this one for different reasons that will kind of come to at the

[00:13:12] very end of the series.

[00:13:13] But in the beginning of this, Harry kind of comes out of this dream

[00:13:18] or it comes out of the memory.

[00:13:19] And again, he's like, he has this line.

[00:13:23] Harry understood at last that he was not supposed to survive.

[00:13:28] His job was to walk calmly into death's welcoming arms along the way.

[00:13:32] He was to dispose of Voldemort's remaining links to life so that

[00:13:35] when at last he flung himself across Voldemort's path and did not raise a

[00:13:40] wand to defend himself, the end would be clean.

[00:13:42] And the job that ought to have been in Godric, been done in Godric's

[00:13:47] hollow would be finished.

[00:13:48] Neither would live, neither could survive.

[00:13:52] So was that the summary of this chapter?

[00:13:54] No.

[00:13:55] Oh, we didn't even do a summary of this chapter.

[00:13:57] That was me nudging lightly.

[00:14:00] Do you want to do the summary?

[00:14:02] No.

[00:14:04] Yeah, do it. You're good at them.

[00:14:05] I don't remember.

[00:14:06] That's why I wanted it.

[00:14:08] She needs a summary.

[00:14:09] I think I do too.

[00:14:11] Well, this is Harry's, his death march, you know?

[00:14:16] So he, at the end of the last chapter, we're left wondering,

[00:14:21] is he going to, how is he going to react to everything he saw?

[00:14:26] And we were being skeptical.

[00:14:27] Then we find out he's kind of accepting it from the first paragraph

[00:14:31] like John just read.

[00:14:32] Oh, it's when he like tucks his wand in and walks.

[00:14:35] Yeah, he's saying I'm going to just go for it.

[00:14:38] But then everyone who's, some people are appearing.

[00:14:40] They're like...

[00:14:41] Right. So that was from the Resurrection Stone because...

[00:14:45] Well, that was in the stitch because he tells a snitch.

[00:14:47] Yeah, yeah.

[00:14:48] Because he...

[00:14:49] He got a lot of answers in the chapter.

[00:14:50] Yeah, he said the clothes.

[00:14:51] I forget exactly what the wording was.

[00:14:53] He says I'm gonna go, I'm gonna die or something.

[00:14:56] Like the clothes of his story, his life.

[00:14:59] Yeah. So then he feels the Resurrection Stone, sees all the people,

[00:15:03] and then he kind of gets to...

[00:15:05] They walk with him.

[00:15:06] Yeah, for a little bit.

[00:15:07] And then he makes it to...

[00:15:09] Now I remember.

[00:15:10] Yeah, now all the neurons are firing.

[00:15:12] Right before that too, he tells Neville, he like spills...

[00:15:15] Oh yeah.

[00:15:16] Not necessarily spills beans, but he's like,

[00:15:17] you have to destroy the snake.

[00:15:18] He tells Neville that he has to destroy the snake right before.

[00:15:20] And then, yeah, it gets like, it's processional.

[00:15:22] Then he walks, gets down to the forest,

[00:15:24] like, you know, has all the memories of Hagrid and his cabin

[00:15:27] and goes into the forest, finds Resurrection Stone

[00:15:31] and everything.

[00:15:32] Then he kind of walks through this

[00:15:34] and then at the very end of the chapter

[00:15:35] he sees a flash of green light

[00:15:37] and then that's the end of the chapter.

[00:15:39] Oh, and Hagrid was in the circle there?

[00:15:41] Alive.

[00:15:42] Captive.

[00:15:43] Yeah.

[00:15:44] Oh yeah, and he's like, Harry, don't go.

[00:15:46] Blah, blah, blah.

[00:15:47] Blah, blah, blah.

[00:15:49] And then you had that line.

[00:15:52] Who had what line?

[00:15:53] Well, he was reading the line

[00:15:55] and then I got interrupted.

[00:15:56] This is another line that you have,

[00:15:59] which I want to do part of the same thing,

[00:16:01] but it says Dumbledore's betrayal was almost nothing.

[00:16:04] Of course there had been a bigger plan.

[00:16:06] Harry had simply been too foolish to see it.

[00:16:09] He realized that now.

[00:16:10] So again, was Dumbledore really just raising him

[00:16:14] like a pig for slaughter?

[00:16:16] Is the whole purpose of Harry's life,

[00:16:18] has the whole purpose of Harry's life been to die

[00:16:20] at this moment?

[00:16:21] I guess I don't get that though.

[00:16:24] Like why keep him?

[00:16:28] I guess it's like either Dumbledore just needed

[00:16:31] to figure out all the Horcruxes

[00:16:33] until he figured them out.

[00:16:35] Harry could live.

[00:16:37] Like, I don't understand.

[00:16:39] And also we, I'm trying to remember in the memories though

[00:16:42] when Dumbledore knew that Harry would have to die

[00:16:45] because maybe he didn't know that Harry was a Horcrux

[00:16:48] and he's looking at everything else and saying

[00:16:51] like maybe there's a chance

[00:16:53] that we have to figure out a way to work this out.

[00:16:56] And then he just concluded,

[00:16:58] and he's so good with his emotions you can't tell.

[00:17:00] So it came off a little cold in the memory of like

[00:17:03] yeah, he's gotta, this is how it has to be.

[00:17:06] But that's the same way Dumbledore was about his own death.

[00:17:09] He finds out he has, you know, wizard cancer here

[00:17:11] and basically he kind of knows like this is serious

[00:17:14] and says all right well, I'm gonna face this

[00:17:17] and come up with a new plan and pivot

[00:17:20] and he, I think, I'm assuming the same kind of thing

[00:17:24] with Harry where it may have come off cold

[00:17:26] but only because he realized it's what had to be done

[00:17:29] but I'm still trying to hold out hope

[00:17:31] that there's more to the Dumbledore side

[00:17:34] but I just can't figure out how.

[00:17:36] Like what would the extra, what would that missing piece be

[00:17:39] where Dumbledore really did care for him?

[00:17:41] What's the Dumbledore always, you know?

[00:17:44] Where how could he have not been raising Harry

[00:17:49] in a manipulative way?

[00:17:51] I just can't quite figure it out.

[00:17:53] Well, there's, I guess there's a point to it

[00:17:55] in this chapter where you see like

[00:17:57] maybe here's a question, did Dumbledore,

[00:17:59] do you think that Dumbledore loved Harry?

[00:18:02] Yes.

[00:18:04] Yes.

[00:18:07] I feel like, can I say something?

[00:18:10] Yeah.

[00:18:11] Maybe I'll actually speak.

[00:18:13] Yeah, I think.

[00:18:15] I feel like he grew to love him.

[00:18:18] If that makes sense.

[00:18:20] Because I feel like

[00:18:22] it's all kind of like just making sense to me now,

[00:18:25] even with like how he was a Horcrux

[00:18:29] so it's like in order to get rid of Voldemort

[00:18:32] you have to get rid of the Horcruxes

[00:18:34] so it's like I wonder if Dumbledore

[00:18:36] thought of him as just like this object kind of at first

[00:18:40] so it was like he kind of was taking him under his wing

[00:18:43] but through that he kind of learned to love

[00:18:46] like he got to know him.

[00:18:48] Yeah.

[00:18:49] So it's like the more you get to know him and Harry,

[00:18:52] you know, is he lovable?

[00:18:56] I was going to say he's like lovable

[00:18:58] but you know he's like his own, he's Harry,

[00:19:00] you know, he's just so Harry.

[00:19:02] It's like how could you not grow to love him?

[00:19:05] Yeah.

[00:19:06] You know the line that's a little weird to me

[00:19:08] from Dumbledore where Snape is complaining about

[00:19:11] Harry just like his father, mediocre, arrogant

[00:19:16] and Dumbledore does defend Harry,

[00:19:18] say you see what you expect to see

[00:19:20] but then he says personally I find him an engaging child

[00:19:23] and that just feels kind of like distant to me.

[00:19:26] He's so utilitarian.

[00:19:27] Yeah, just like he's a pretty engaging child.

[00:19:30] It's like it just feels so scientific

[00:19:32] and like he's just from a distance

[00:19:34] observing a Horcrux walking around

[00:19:36] just like just like analyzing him.

[00:19:38] You're fine too.

[00:19:39] Sure.

[00:19:40] It feels weird.

[00:19:41] Yeah, exactly.

[00:19:42] Just like a very, he's just assessing him.

[00:19:44] He's an engaging child.

[00:19:45] Not like not loving him,

[00:19:47] not like this deep, there's not feeling there.

[00:19:49] It's just like he's engaging.

[00:19:52] Like his merit is just how much he entertains you.

[00:19:56] Like again it's the engagement of him

[00:19:58] that is what it's appealing

[00:20:00] when I feel like there are so many other things

[00:20:02] Dumbledore could have said

[00:20:04] but again you don't put all your secrets in one basket.

[00:20:06] So that's on page 679 of this book.

[00:20:09] I don't know if it's the same

[00:20:10] but it's when Harry's in the memory

[00:20:13] in the princess tale and it's kind of in

[00:20:16] when Snape is the teacher now

[00:20:19] and he's talking to Dumbledore,

[00:20:20] Harry's probably, this must be

[00:20:22] in book two or three or something.

[00:20:28] And he's just kind of venting

[00:20:29] and it's a funny moment

[00:20:30] so I'm not sure if we have any indication

[00:20:32] of when this would be in the books.

[00:20:34] Harry obviously has a little funny but

[00:20:36] It's interesting because I feel like

[00:20:37] there's a point where Dumbledore

[00:20:40] is really good at talking the talk

[00:20:43] of all this kind of stuff

[00:20:44] like you know talking about the power of love

[00:20:46] but the question is does Dumbledore

[00:20:47] really ever love anyone

[00:20:48] or does he have any love in his heart

[00:20:49] or has he shut that out for himself?

[00:20:51] Because I mean you talked about the way

[00:20:53] that he even like he mentions

[00:20:55] that line is such a funny line to me

[00:20:57] because he talks about Cedric

[00:20:59] at Cedric's funeral in a much more beautiful way.

[00:21:01] Yes.

[00:21:02] Then he talks about Harry

[00:21:03] who spends like all this time with

[00:21:05] But Harry he's just like an interesting

[00:21:07] you know subject

[00:21:09] with Cedric it was like remember a boy

[00:21:11] who is good

[00:21:12] like he remembers him for his goodness

[00:21:14] and for his kindness

[00:21:15] and you know the things that make up a hufflepuff

[00:21:17] and you're like

[00:21:19] Maybe because it's like

[00:21:21] he's like an unknown

[00:21:22] like they don't know which way he could go

[00:21:24] because I was even thinking

[00:21:25] while you guys were talking like

[00:21:26] what if Dumbledore shared this

[00:21:29] information with Harry too young

[00:21:31] and then Harry actually wants to

[00:21:33] join forces with

[00:21:35] like the crazy opposite

[00:21:37] where he could join forces with Voldemort

[00:21:39] and they both would be against everyone

[00:21:41] like they could live forever

[00:21:43] because of their let's say connected

[00:21:46] so I don't know if he had to be careful

[00:21:48] because he also got burned

[00:21:50] by bringing Voldemort in

[00:21:52] and so he had to keep his dis

[00:21:54] like I don't know I just

[00:21:56] there's other things that probably play into him

[00:21:59] dissing himself

[00:22:01] and not falling in love with this boy

[00:22:04] and like let's keep him alive

[00:22:06] and see what he's capable of

[00:22:08] Yeah, no, I think you're totally right

[00:22:13] If you got burned already once

[00:22:16] by like bringing someone

[00:22:18] into like knowledge

[00:22:20] and power

[00:22:21] Yeah, shut himself off of that

[00:22:23] a little bit

[00:22:25] Yeah, which I mean that's like the question

[00:22:27] so I mean one of the tough ones is

[00:22:29] when did Dumbledore really know about this plan

[00:22:31] because if you knew about this from the start

[00:22:33] he seems like he was being manipulative from while

[00:22:35] but if you knew about this maybe later on

[00:22:37] and he grew to love Harry

[00:22:38] then this becomes a much more devastating decision

[00:22:40] that he has to make

[00:22:41] but it seems like he knew this early on

[00:22:43] so maybe he just grows to love Harry

[00:22:45] and it becomes painful for him to do this

[00:22:47] like did he send them off

[00:22:49] to Petunia's and Vernon's

[00:22:51] so that he could just be safe

[00:22:53] so that he could die in the proper time

[00:22:55] or he knows some other ancient magic

[00:22:57] that he's like you have to sacrifice yourself

[00:22:59] but you're not actually gonna die

[00:23:01] Here's the tough part of that

[00:23:03] is has there been any indication in the books

[00:23:05] ever

[00:23:06] that Dumbledore has known something like

[00:23:08] like there's been like you know

[00:23:10] this

[00:23:11] The whole book

[00:23:12] he's known something Harry didn't know

[00:23:14] Yeah, that's true

[00:23:15] but he's known something Harry hasn't known

[00:23:17] that Harry was supposed to die

[00:23:19] Has there been any indication that Dumbledore

[00:23:21] has like shot this like

[00:23:23] has been like victorious over something

[00:23:25] and like you know maybe spilled some

[00:23:27] beans to Harry

[00:23:29] inadvertently about oh there's

[00:23:31] the way that you can live

[00:23:33] The only time, no, yeah

[00:23:35] the only time was like

[00:23:37] I don't think it's answering your question

[00:23:39] but when the ministry of magic

[00:23:41] when Voldemort tries to take over Harry's body

[00:23:43] and he had to get out of it

[00:23:45] because it's too much like love

[00:23:47] Yeah

[00:23:49] But that's what I find

[00:23:51] strange

[00:23:52] to like their connect

[00:23:54] I don't know

[00:23:56] it's just

[00:23:57] it's weird because I'm like

[00:23:59] if he took over the body

[00:24:01] there was too much love

[00:24:03] but he left it

[00:24:05] so couldn't that part of him

[00:24:07] leave and he'd still be alive

[00:24:09] Yeah

[00:24:11] I guess we just don't know how

[00:24:13] Horcrux is work

[00:24:15] especially

[00:24:17] in a human

[00:24:18] But also if he's trying to kill Harry

[00:24:22] but you have to use

[00:24:24] what is it if you use dark magic to kill

[00:24:26] a Horcrux

[00:24:28] No, different

[00:24:30] because the sort of Gryffindor was not

[00:24:32] dark

[00:24:34] and that could kill it

[00:24:36] All I'm saying is like would it actually

[00:24:38] kill Harry though?

[00:24:40] Like even if you used the

[00:24:42] killing curse because let's say he is a

[00:24:44] Horcrux

[00:24:46] would a killing curse kill a Horcrux

[00:24:48] I don't know

[00:24:50] Well we had speculated what if the person

[00:24:52] who created the Horcrux

[00:24:54] is the one doing it

[00:24:56] and that would be different or the elder wand

[00:24:58] That's what I thought

[00:25:00] So like those are two ways that it could

[00:25:02] still work

[00:25:04] And even the sword

[00:25:06] the sword only can destroy

[00:25:08] a Horcrux because it's impregnated of something

[00:25:10] not wicked but a basilisk

[00:25:12] basilisk venom

[00:25:14] So that's the reason it can destroy a

[00:25:16] Horcrux not because it's just the sword of

[00:25:18] Gryffindor Interesting

[00:25:20] Yeah, yeah, yeah

[00:25:22] Cause I thought even Dumbledore had trouble

[00:25:24] So if you're doing the killing curse

[00:25:26] and I know it's a person but if it's a

[00:25:28] Horcrux what does that combo

[00:25:30] look like and could you actually kill them

[00:25:32] with the killing curse

[00:25:34] Wait could who

[00:25:36] It could Voldemort actually kill

[00:25:38] Harry

[00:25:40] or his own Horcrux

[00:25:42] Because if he's part

[00:25:44] Horcrux part Voldemort

[00:25:46] what is that gonna do

[00:25:48] Yeah exactly, well that's the question

[00:25:50] that we're left with at the end of the chapter

[00:25:52] because we don't know

[00:25:54] But you know what my faith in Dumbledore

[00:25:56] is growing because

[00:25:58] it opened up the close

[00:26:00] sounds like it

[00:26:02] And well I guess that's a weird thing too

[00:26:04] like Dumbledore knew there was going

[00:26:06] to be a close

[00:26:08] He knew that Harry would still

[00:26:10] have this

[00:26:12] snitch at the close

[00:26:14] of his life and then he kind

[00:26:16] of it seems like knew that Harry

[00:26:18] was gonna figure it out

[00:26:20] at the end

[00:26:22] But is he just setting him up

[00:26:24] to have like stage

[00:26:26] an acting thing when

[00:26:28] he's setting like he's like

[00:26:30] he's spilling like little information

[00:26:32] so everyone believes this but it's not actually true

[00:26:34] Like Dumbledore could be

[00:26:36] feeding Snape saying

[00:26:38] like he has to die and

[00:26:40] then those are the memories that people see

[00:26:42] and then they're believing it and then Harry actually

[00:26:44] goes and sacrifices himself

[00:26:46] but actually that's the best thing

[00:26:48] sacrificing yourself because there's no

[00:26:50] you guys mentioned this I think during

[00:26:52] a live read or maybe even last one

[00:26:54] so do you think by Harry sacrificing himself like this

[00:26:56] that there's gonna be some kind of protection

[00:26:58] on the school or something like that

[00:27:00] or on the rest of the people?

[00:27:02] kind of on everyone else because he's dying for them

[00:27:04] willingly in this moment

[00:27:06] well yeah but that's the only way

[00:27:08] that I can be okay with it

[00:27:10] I wanna vote

[00:27:12] because it's like then that makes sense

[00:27:14] again that's the

[00:27:16] that kind of finishes the

[00:27:18] interesting I was gonna say finishes the Christ

[00:27:20] Ark but it actually doesn't

[00:27:22] and so it's

[00:27:24] to me it feels like this is

[00:27:26] the like his moment

[00:27:28] to do what Dumbledore wants

[00:27:30] him to do and he has chosen

[00:27:32] in this chapter to trust

[00:27:34] Dumbledore

[00:27:36] by saying you know what if I have

[00:27:38] to die then I do and I'm gonna go

[00:27:40] and he seems to not even question it

[00:27:42] and he's gonna do it with his wand

[00:27:44] down so I think as he's

[00:27:46] trusting Dumbledore I am too

[00:27:48] and to be completely I have

[00:27:50] one slight amendment

[00:27:52] to that I don't know so much as if he's

[00:27:54] trusting Dumbledore so much as

[00:27:56] he's just coming to the realization himself

[00:27:58] oh yeah realizing this is what he needs

[00:28:00] to do and he's known it all along

[00:28:02] right like there's a point to this

[00:28:04] chapter where you're like Harry is marching down

[00:28:06] and he's like

[00:28:08] he's coming to this realization and he's like

[00:28:10] okay so Dumbledore kind of explains this but in the back

[00:28:12] of his mind I think he's like

[00:28:14] I knew this was my

[00:28:16] you know allotted path the entire time

[00:28:20] he's I don't know there's a

[00:28:22] like a hint to this chapter where it seems like that

[00:28:24] but maybe it is just flat out he's

[00:28:26] trusting in Dumbledore for this

[00:28:28] so if he's trusting in Dumbledore maybe

[00:28:30] Dumbledore has like this greater path laid out

[00:28:32] for him but yeah you just don't know

[00:28:34] wait what

[00:28:36] my thought process was

[00:28:38] why Dumbledore gave him

[00:28:42] the resurrection stone for just

[00:28:44] if he even knew that this was the moment

[00:28:46] just to say goodbye to some people

[00:28:48] like or to have a little

[00:28:50] extra nudge did he need that nudge

[00:28:52] didn't seem like it but maybe

[00:28:54] yeah sure okay yeah

[00:28:56] I guess I'm trying to find a way where he has

[00:28:58] all of the hollows together

[00:29:00] because he has the

[00:29:02] resurrection stone he has the invisibility cloak

[00:29:04] and he has a wand on his chest

[00:29:06] but whose wand is that

[00:29:08] Draco's

[00:29:10] Draco's wand

[00:29:12] Draco didn't even pick up his own wand

[00:29:14] his parents did

[00:29:16] would Dumbledore have given

[00:29:18] Draco the elder

[00:29:20] wand as a child

[00:29:22] to use all this time

[00:29:24] knowing that Harry would end up with it

[00:29:26] because it feels

[00:29:28] like Dumbledore has set up this moment

[00:29:30] and

[00:29:32] I just want to see

[00:29:34] what's the thing where this goes well

[00:29:36] because it doesn't look like it now

[00:29:38] and

[00:29:40] yeah but I don't know when it has the faith in things

[00:29:42] that you don't

[00:29:44] well I'm trying to logic my way

[00:29:46] into them

[00:29:48] like it working out

[00:29:50] and the wand is the part

[00:29:52] that we just don't understand

[00:29:54] Voldemort is convinced he has the elder wand

[00:29:56] I don't think it's going to work for him if it is the wand

[00:29:58] but then how does Harry get it

[00:30:02] because he's the better wizard

[00:30:04] but he's dead

[00:30:06] he's not dead

[00:30:08] well we just don't know but the thing is Voldemort

[00:30:10] is literally using the wand to attack Harry

[00:30:12] so that feels

[00:30:14] weird

[00:30:16] yeah but if it's someone that's

[00:30:18] not putting up a fight

[00:30:20] would it actually kill them

[00:30:22] is that in a weird way

[00:30:24] like more noble the wands like yo I respect that Harry

[00:30:26] and there

[00:30:28] I mean yeah maybe

[00:30:30] I don't know

[00:30:32] Wannlor in this book is really interesting

[00:30:34] because

[00:30:36] yeah I didn't even touch that

[00:30:38] Wannlor has been interesting in this book

[00:30:40] because you've seen wands pass

[00:30:42] in really bizarre ways

[00:30:44] like the elder wand has passed through

[00:30:46] it seems like

[00:30:48] sneaky

[00:30:50] like

[00:30:52] inadvertent ways it's not necessarily just

[00:30:54] flat out beating the owner in a duel

[00:30:56] it's like you know

[00:30:58] he's armed and all of a sudden Snape comes and kills him

[00:31:00] so it's like he gets the wand

[00:31:02] because this weird little occurrence

[00:31:04] happened versus like either

[00:31:06] even other people like Hermione or Ron

[00:31:08] steals all these wands from Snatchers

[00:31:10] and maybe are they the rightful owners

[00:31:12] of the wand the same thing with like Draco's wand

[00:31:14] like Harry has Draco's wand now

[00:31:16] is he the rightful owner of Draco's wand

[00:31:18] what does that mean for everything

[00:31:20] Wann ownership is weird in this book

[00:31:22] that's why I also think that

[00:31:24] like it has kind of

[00:31:26] its own so like

[00:31:28] if it's made for

[00:31:30] that whole death

[00:31:32] what the Hallows tail

[00:31:34] right or whatever

[00:31:38] Harry is a tail in his own

[00:31:40] too so like

[00:31:42] he defeated death also

[00:31:44] so in a way

[00:31:46] couldn't he be like

[00:31:48] his own elder wand

[00:31:50] like can't he be his own

[00:31:52] Hallow

[00:31:54] what you threw me off at that one

[00:31:56] like he's a Horcrux and a Hallow

[00:31:58] double whammy

[00:32:00] you're saying just because his story

[00:32:02] is like something that would be in

[00:32:04] the fairy tale book

[00:32:06] yeah like it's like all these are

[00:32:08] trying to defeat death but Harry

[00:32:10] actually defeated death

[00:32:12] as a person so like

[00:32:14] is it possible

[00:32:16] that

[00:32:18] it won't work on him

[00:32:20] and would he still have love protection

[00:32:22] or is that a one time use

[00:32:24] he's got it all

[00:32:26] he does have it all

[00:32:28] and if he gets love protection

[00:32:30] wouldn't he have gotten that from a bunch of other people already

[00:32:32] like in a weird way

[00:32:34] aren't all these people dying for Harry

[00:32:36] like did Dumbledore give him a little

[00:32:38] love protection in the meantime

[00:32:40] I know but my point was about like the death thing

[00:32:42] that he's a Hallow

[00:32:44] no all these objects were

[00:32:46] to defeat death everything

[00:32:48] in this book is to defeat death

[00:32:50] and like Harry's the only one that's actually

[00:32:52] like accomplished that

[00:32:54] so like everyone wants way he is

[00:32:58] so like is it possible that like

[00:33:00] nothing can touch him

[00:33:04] so here's another line that we

[00:33:06] even have in this whole series where

[00:33:08] it says

[00:33:10] Harry pulled the invisibility cloak over himself

[00:33:12] and descended through the floors

[00:33:14] at last walking down the marble staircase

[00:33:16] into the entrance hall perhaps some tiny

[00:33:18] part of him hoped to be sent

[00:33:20] to be seen to be stopped

[00:33:22] but the cloak was as ever impenetrable

[00:33:24] perfect and he reached

[00:33:26] the front doors easily

[00:33:28] do you guys think if you were in that situation

[00:33:30] you would have done what Harry did

[00:33:32] and not said goodbye or would you

[00:33:34] have said goodbye

[00:33:38] I think I would say goodbye

[00:33:40] but then probably hard to say goodbye

[00:33:42] I don't know

[00:33:44] I feel I'd like

[00:33:46] to say that I would have said goodbye that's my instinct

[00:33:48] but I think in that moment

[00:33:50] there's a certain

[00:33:52] fragility

[00:33:54] to doing what you have to do

[00:33:56] so once you know you have to do

[00:33:58] something especially hard things

[00:34:00] or things you don't want to do

[00:34:02] sometimes I don't know if you've experienced

[00:34:04] this where you feel like

[00:34:06] you just can't think about anything else

[00:34:08] you just got to like do it you kind of be

[00:34:10] line for the thing because

[00:34:12] you know if you have a chance to stop

[00:34:14] or do whatever other thing

[00:34:16] in Harry's case

[00:34:18] he might not do it

[00:34:20] or it would slow him down

[00:34:22] or it would just like mess with his resolve

[00:34:24] so in that moment maybe

[00:34:26] maybe that's

[00:34:28] the only way to do it

[00:34:30] because what's like that would be torturous

[00:34:32] to say all his goodbyes

[00:34:34] it's a little weird that he only said goodbye to Neville

[00:34:36] kind of

[00:34:38] he spoke to him but that was it and Neville didn't know

[00:34:40] and then I'm curious

[00:34:42] what happens to the Penceve

[00:34:44] are Hermione and Ron

[00:34:46] running out trying to

[00:34:48] find Nagini now

[00:34:50] yeah and how are they going to destroy Nagini?

[00:34:52] right and it has to be

[00:34:54] happening like now

[00:34:56] because

[00:34:58] otherwise it gets more complicated

[00:35:00] with Waldenwort

[00:35:02] and he'll still have

[00:35:04] a Horcrux left

[00:35:06] so I don't know it's a little weird

[00:35:08] so I guess that the not saying goodbye makes sense to me

[00:35:12] yeah it makes sense

[00:35:14] I just don't know if I could do

[00:35:16] but I wasn't mad about it when I was reading it

[00:35:18] I'm like yeah

[00:35:20] cause you guys were even debating that in the previous one

[00:35:22] you're like does would he go

[00:35:24] tell Hermione or go with him

[00:35:26] or like communicate this

[00:35:28] and I think Danny you were like yeah he definitely would

[00:35:30] he should

[00:35:32] it would show a lot of growth and then all of a sudden he's going and doing this alone

[00:35:34] which is very Harry but it's like almost noble of Harry to do that

[00:35:36] yeah

[00:35:38] kind of like respect him for it almost

[00:35:40] I don't know

[00:35:42] and maybe he knows it too

[00:35:44] I don't know if anyone else would have understood

[00:35:46] I can't imagine

[00:35:48] Hermione or Ron being like

[00:35:50] that sounds like a good idea we support you

[00:35:52] you know like I think they would try and talk him out of it

[00:35:54] and say we have to come up with some other plan

[00:35:56] for him just to say

[00:35:58] no I need to actually die

[00:36:00] I don't know

[00:36:02] just that would take some convincing

[00:36:04] and he doesn't have time for that

[00:36:06] um

[00:36:08] so they'd be pretty out of the loop

[00:36:10] not knowing

[00:36:12] all the memories

[00:36:14] and that's a tough story to explain

[00:36:16] hmm

[00:36:18] but that's also kind of sad because then

[00:36:20] if Harry dies

[00:36:22] they would never know

[00:36:24] that Snape was good

[00:36:26] except Dumbledore's portrait is the only remaining

[00:36:28] thing that would

[00:36:30] kind of know

[00:36:32] would it be nice if all three of them went into the

[00:36:34] pensive

[00:36:36] and that is possible because Dumbledore did with

[00:36:38] Harry before

[00:36:40] I know but it's just like they disappeared

[00:36:42] yeah it seems like they didn't

[00:36:44] because then they all could come out

[00:36:46] and then Harry could just be like bye

[00:36:52] I don't know

[00:36:54] was the moment

[00:36:56] where

[00:36:58] he pulls the resurrection stone out of the

[00:37:00] snitch was that a surprise to you guys

[00:37:02] do you guys

[00:37:04] again even I guess

[00:37:06] they're question is there a purpose for that other

[00:37:08] than him just to not be alone when he's dying

[00:37:12] maybe yeah

[00:37:14] I just can't figure out what

[00:37:18] because I'm trying to find a way

[00:37:20] where Harry gets all three

[00:37:22] I mean it's the title of the book after all

[00:37:26] and I can't figure out if that's

[00:37:28] how Dumbledore could have orchestrated

[00:37:30] that either in the past like we had said

[00:37:32] after the wand was first

[00:37:34] stolen by

[00:37:36] Grindelwald from

[00:37:38] Grigorovich

[00:37:40] it felt like there was a moment

[00:37:42] where Dumbledore

[00:37:44] borrowed the

[00:37:46] invisibility cloak from James

[00:37:48] back when they died

[00:37:50] that we were saying Dumbledore might

[00:37:52] have had all three

[00:37:54] of these items then

[00:37:58] although

[00:38:00] ooh no

[00:38:02] no you're right because that's back when I was saying

[00:38:04] there was a chance that

[00:38:06] the resurrection

[00:38:08] stone was

[00:38:10] the philosopher's stone

[00:38:12] so

[00:38:14] could he have had all three

[00:38:16] of these items so yeah he had two

[00:38:18] and that could have done something

[00:38:20] but now all three

[00:38:22] of these items are within

[00:38:24] the same circle of fighting

[00:38:26] and I'm just trying to see

[00:38:28] how Dumbledore could have

[00:38:30] set this up

[00:38:32] in any kind of way

[00:38:34] to go well and it feels like that's why

[00:38:36] the resurrection stone was in the snitch

[00:38:38] again I don't know why

[00:38:40] or maybe this is all part of

[00:38:42] a thing to get them destroyed

[00:38:44] because it's too much power

[00:38:46] so

[00:38:48] when Harry and the Horcrux

[00:38:50] get killed

[00:38:52] in some crazy way

[00:38:54] then maybe all of these things

[00:38:56] die or something I don't know

[00:38:58] and then it's a way

[00:39:00] that there's no more Horcrux

[00:39:02] issue, no more halos

[00:39:04] and they're all just left behind

[00:39:08] all at once

[00:39:10] maybe

[00:39:14] but I feel like Dumbledore has a plan

[00:39:16] yeah

[00:39:18] I just wish I knew what it was

[00:39:20] that's the whole idea in this is that you just don't know what

[00:39:22] what's going on

[00:39:24] to some extent

[00:39:26] you see Harry as Mark

[00:39:28] walking in

[00:39:30] willingly

[00:39:32] I don't know, there's a point to it

[00:39:34] where maybe Dumbledore's plan

[00:39:36] was exactly what Harry's thinking

[00:39:38] but I guess sometimes part of your

[00:39:40] love for Dumbledore is

[00:39:42] he wouldn't just

[00:39:44] have that

[00:39:46] but it's like the reverse of Snape

[00:39:48] you only really hated Snape and you wanted him

[00:39:50] so it's maybe like the opposite of Dumbledore

[00:39:52] you love and all of a sudden you realize he's a little bit more corrupt

[00:39:54] immature

[00:39:56] and really manipulated the situation

[00:39:58] and it's just going to be left with that

[00:40:00] which is just, it would be a tough one

[00:40:02] but it's very human nature

[00:40:04] are we really Snape good?

[00:40:06] oh yeah, he works

[00:40:08] on the good side and not a good person

[00:40:12] yeah

[00:40:16] well that goes to my theory about the Ulcelerans

[00:40:18] awesome

[00:40:20] anyway

[00:40:22] wait what about Ulcelerans?

[00:40:24] no they're all death eaters but you guys don't

[00:40:26] know that you could be good and bad

[00:40:28] and blah blah blah

[00:40:30] and yeah I guess like when John was saying that

[00:40:32] I didn't know exactly

[00:40:34] who that would be

[00:40:36] someone like in my mind Horace was a great example

[00:40:38] because he was kind of helpful

[00:40:40] oh Slyhorn

[00:40:42] wait what?

[00:40:44] wait what was that?

[00:40:46] exactly

[00:40:48] and it feels like Dumbledore kind of

[00:40:50] trusted him and whatever

[00:40:52] but every other Slyhorn was

[00:40:54] and then Dumbledore even told Snape

[00:40:56] we maybe sort too early

[00:40:58] he might have been a Gryffindor

[00:41:00] and according to that theory it's like yeah well maybe all Slytherans really are bad

[00:41:02] none of them stayed behind to fight

[00:41:04] I know, that was devastating none of them stayed back

[00:41:06] uh yeah

[00:41:08] which I was right about

[00:41:10] awesome

[00:41:12] yep

[00:41:14] so 10 to 0

[00:41:16] 2

[00:41:18] we do have again someone gave all the predictions

[00:41:20] for like certain things

[00:41:22] and we'll have like a little discussion

[00:41:24] after the whole podcast is done

[00:41:26] and uh we'll talk about what your predictions were

[00:41:28] someone actually tallied

[00:41:30] someone back in like recorded all of your

[00:41:32] there's awesome

[00:41:34] thing in our discord and it's just one person

[00:41:36] essentially was listening to it and we caught him early enough

[00:41:38] that they're like alright I'll just you know

[00:41:40] no way

[00:41:42] this minute

[00:41:44] you know Jen predicts this

[00:41:46] and this minute Danny predicts this

[00:41:48] I wanted to know this

[00:41:50] so I can't believe someone actually did it

[00:41:52] I'm very excited to go through that guy

[00:41:54] cause it's gonna be fun

[00:41:56] cause you guys forgot

[00:41:58] most of the stuff that you predicted

[00:42:00] well some of it

[00:42:02] wow that's exciting

[00:42:04] I hope I win

[00:42:06] all of a sudden it's a competition

[00:42:08] with the real winners

[00:42:10] well it's been a vague idea of a competition

[00:42:12] but now there's gonna be a score

[00:42:14] you know what I mean

[00:42:16] that's what I'm excited about

[00:42:18] you're excited to lose huh

[00:42:20] no I'm winning

[00:42:22] I mean yeah it could be close

[00:42:24] we'll see what we have to bet on it you know

[00:42:26] I love the sentimentality

[00:42:28] of this chapter though there's a few moments

[00:42:30] especially when it says

[00:42:32] when Harry's like marching and he

[00:42:34] is about to use the resurrection stone

[00:42:36] it says again Harry understood without having to think

[00:42:38] it did not matter about bringing them back

[00:42:40] for he was about to join them

[00:42:42] he was not really fetching them

[00:42:44] they were fetching him

[00:42:46] and then when they're back it says Lily's smile was widest of all

[00:42:48] she pushed her long hair back

[00:42:50] cause she drew closer to him

[00:42:52] and her green eyes so like his

[00:42:54] searched his face hungrily

[00:42:56] as though she would never be able to look at him enough

[00:42:58] you've been so brave

[00:43:00] he could not speak

[00:43:02] his eyes feasted on her

[00:43:04] and he thought that he would like to stand

[00:43:06] and that would be enough

[00:43:08] yeah I mean

[00:43:10] you guys we've talked about why Harry brought them back

[00:43:12] but um

[00:43:14] this is like the final line

[00:43:16] which shows just a lot of Harry's bravery

[00:43:18] in this whole section

[00:43:20] um it says

[00:43:22] and Voldemort says

[00:43:24] I thought he would come said Voldemort

[00:43:26] in his high clear voice

[00:43:28] his eyes on the leaping flames

[00:43:30] I expected him to come

[00:43:32] nobody spoke

[00:43:34] but Voldemort was now throwing itself against his ribs

[00:43:36] as though determined to escape

[00:43:38] the body he was about to cast aside

[00:43:40] his hands were sweating as he pulled off the invisibility

[00:43:42] invisibility cloak

[00:43:44] and stuffed it beneath his robes

[00:43:46] with his wand

[00:43:48] he did not want to be tempted to fight

[00:43:50] I what

[00:43:52] it seems mistaken said Voldemort

[00:43:54] you weren't said Harry

[00:43:56] um and he said it as loudly as he could

[00:43:58] with all the force he could muster

[00:44:00] he did not want to sound afraid

[00:44:02] he slipped from beneath between his numb fingers

[00:44:04] and out of the corner of his eyes he saw his parents

[00:44:06] serious and looping vanishes as he

[00:44:08] stepped forward into the firelight

[00:44:10] at that moment he felt that nobody mattered

[00:44:12] but Voldemort it was just the two of them

[00:44:14] what do you think about Harry in this whole chapter

[00:44:16] he shows a lot of maturity

[00:44:18] but how did you like him

[00:44:20] as a like marching to his death like this

[00:44:24] I like the noble

[00:44:26] brave

[00:44:28] pretty true griffin door

[00:44:30] yeah

[00:44:32] I didn't realize

[00:44:34] represent

[00:44:36] yep

[00:44:38] I'm not like that

[00:44:44] they didn't drag me out

[00:44:46] I'd be hiding

[00:44:48] in my invisibility cloak

[00:44:50] and no one would ever find me

[00:44:52] I

[00:44:54] I

[00:44:56] I

[00:44:58] like what's that

[00:45:00] the one guy who falls asleep in the middle of the woods

[00:45:02] and wakes up 30 years later

[00:45:04] Van Winkle

[00:45:06] that's a genadve she'd be like a legend in Hogwarts

[00:45:08] she would just go under the invisibility cloak

[00:45:10] fall asleep in the forest for 30 years

[00:45:12] and all of a sudden wake up

[00:45:14] oh my gosh

[00:45:16] yeah probably

[00:45:22] guys

[00:45:24] final question before we do the read

[00:45:26] is

[00:45:28] Harry dead

[00:45:30] I mean I asked that a lot of times

[00:45:32] how many

[00:45:34] variations of our answer

[00:45:36] there's not a ton of

[00:45:38] else we can even discuss in this chapter unless dana has anything else

[00:45:40] or no

[00:45:42] or something in between

[00:45:48] you look so tan

[00:45:50] I think he's

[00:45:52] dead

[00:45:54] so I mean the options

[00:45:56] you guys are even saying this if he's dead

[00:45:58] then he's cast a protection spell

[00:46:00] and maybe everyone in the entire Hogwarts can be safe

[00:46:02] if he's alive how does that work

[00:46:04] if he's alive what is the point of it

[00:46:06] is then Harry going to defeat Voldemort himself

[00:46:08] and kill the snake

[00:46:10] I'm sorry I got distracted

[00:46:12] well you're good my tannies tan

[00:46:14] and I was more dark

[00:46:16] what's the um

[00:46:18] Christmas with the cranks

[00:46:20] Tim Allen wears dark colors so he doesn't look tan

[00:46:22] I was trying to remember Kim

[00:46:24] I'm wearing red so I matched my sunburn

[00:46:26] nice

[00:46:28] um

[00:46:32] wait yeah sorry

[00:46:34] I feel like Ron and Hermione

[00:46:36] will take care of Nagini

[00:46:38] I don't know how

[00:46:40] oh and Neville the three of them

[00:46:44] I kind of think Harry's dead

[00:46:46] so what happens

[00:46:48] I don't think he's dead

[00:46:50] if Harry's dead so is Voldemort

[00:46:52] except not really because of Nagini

[00:46:54] no no wait how would

[00:46:56] Voldemort get killed then

[00:46:58] literally that was my whole theory

[00:47:00] and we were talking about it for a long time

[00:47:02] wait how then

[00:47:04] because he's killing a part of himself

[00:47:06] he's killing another whore

[00:47:08] yeah but even if he does

[00:47:10] and then even if Ron Hermione and Neville kill Nagini

[00:47:12] Voldemort is still there

[00:47:14] I don't think so

[00:47:16] that's what I'm saying like

[00:47:18] then who kills Voldemort

[00:47:20] I think he

[00:47:22] if Voldemort

[00:47:24] if you kill your own whorecrucks

[00:47:26] I feel like you should die

[00:47:28] but again I think it would only be the whorecrucks

[00:47:30] but then he could still die by another

[00:47:32] means

[00:47:34] like something with using

[00:47:36] the wand when he's not the rightful owner

[00:47:38] if Harry was the rightful owner

[00:47:40] so the wand

[00:47:42] kind of works but then also explodes

[00:47:44] or something

[00:47:46] if Harry is the rightful owner and he uses it on Harry

[00:47:48] then he's killing himself

[00:47:50] then Harry can't be defeated with it

[00:47:52] yeah but I just can't

[00:47:54] it doesn't work for me

[00:47:56] I want it to be true

[00:47:58] I just can't figure out how it would be in a satisfying way

[00:48:00] but then

[00:48:02] does everyone else come together

[00:48:04] no I know that's why none of them are

[00:48:06] we don't have enough pieces

[00:48:08] so I'm like would everyone else

[00:48:10] come together

[00:48:12] he won't have any tethers

[00:48:14] yeah cause that's working really well

[00:48:16] right now

[00:48:18] so basically at the end of this book

[00:48:20] you think Voldemort is

[00:48:22] the winner

[00:48:24] no I think he'll be dead

[00:48:26] and good wins

[00:48:28] either by Harry

[00:48:30] the rest of the students or everybody

[00:48:32] yeah I think he is dead

[00:48:34] but I'm saying if he did

[00:48:36] die

[00:48:38] and then Ron Hermione Neville

[00:48:40] kill Nagini

[00:48:42] then it's just Voldemort

[00:48:44] but no one's been able to defeat

[00:48:46] real Voldemort

[00:48:48] like these kids don't know how to do that

[00:48:50] yeah it's true

[00:48:52] McGonagall

[00:48:54] yeah

[00:48:56] with the Weasleys

[00:48:58] I think that's what I'm trying to do

[00:49:00] he's done death eaters

[00:49:02] which they clearly like Snape

[00:49:04] and Voldemort were not in Hogwarts

[00:49:06] but they were dead

[00:49:08] like the good side

[00:49:10] by death eaters

[00:49:12] so how are these kids going to

[00:49:14] defeat Voldemort

[00:49:16] I don't know

[00:49:18] that's why it's not true

[00:49:20] with love

[00:49:22] love of course

[00:49:24] that's why he can't be dead

[00:49:26] yeah but how does that work

[00:49:28] how does

[00:49:30] him being alive

[00:49:32] cause either Voldemort

[00:49:34] dies and Voldemort dies

[00:49:36] not Harry

[00:49:38] or Voldemort kills

[00:49:40] part of himself

[00:49:42] so then it makes Voldemort

[00:49:44] weaker and then Harry can kill

[00:49:46] Voldemort

[00:49:48] and Nagini in one shot

[00:49:50] or

[00:49:52] someone else is trying to get

[00:49:54] Nagini while he's doing

[00:49:56] going against Voldemort cause it didn't work

[00:49:58] cause maybe

[00:50:00] part

[00:50:02] of his scar disappears

[00:50:04] or part of him disappears

[00:50:06] and you can't see into

[00:50:08] Voldemort's mind anymore

[00:50:10] yeah I could see that

[00:50:12] that's the only way it would work

[00:50:14] like Harry's safe from a love charm

[00:50:16] the same one from his mom and everyone else

[00:50:18] he's wearing the watch the Weasleys gave

[00:50:20] or the howl of his love

[00:50:22] yeah and he's a willing sacrifice

[00:50:24] so all these things

[00:50:26] I think help him

[00:50:28] so then when Voldemort attacks him

[00:50:30] the Horcrux

[00:50:32] or the same thing that happened to Voldemort

[00:50:34] the first time, bounces back like you said

[00:50:36] and he could die from that

[00:50:38] but then Nagini's still a weird loose end

[00:50:40] so they would have to just

[00:50:42] kill Nagini real quick

[00:50:44] after all that

[00:50:46] but he also

[00:50:48] well I don't know if he'll speak parceled tongue after this

[00:50:50] but in theory no

[00:50:52] but Ron can now

[00:50:54] so Ron's taking notes

[00:50:56] translating

[00:51:00] so that's Ron's greatest

[00:51:02] that was really good

[00:51:04] Jen's got it guys

[00:51:06] watch out

[00:51:08] parts slower

[00:51:10] and two

[00:51:14] yeah

[00:51:16] alright well anything else in this chapter

[00:51:18] before we listen

[00:51:22] I'm just waiting to see

[00:51:24] how the gold stuff that came out of

[00:51:26] Harry's wand comes back

[00:51:28] what was the deal

[00:51:30] there's something magical happening

[00:51:32] that goes beyond what we understand

[00:51:34] wait like right now

[00:51:36] in this chapter he mentioned

[00:51:38] his wand

[00:51:40] he mentioned the phoenix feather

[00:51:42] wand

[00:51:44] that broke when he left the Dursleys

[00:51:46] so to have a call back

[00:51:48] to that wand right now

[00:51:50] and walk it just makes me think

[00:51:52] yeah I forgot about that, what was the deal

[00:51:54] it broke

[00:51:56] and then it dropped his wand fixed

[00:51:58] oh yeah is fox ever coming back

[00:52:00] that'd be cool

[00:52:04] can tears bring you back from the dead

[00:52:06] or only heal you

[00:52:08] or can tears bring back a wand

[00:52:12] can it heal the wand because it was

[00:52:14] fox's feather

[00:52:16] and wait the fox feather it dies

[00:52:18] and then it comes back

[00:52:20] maybe if the wand died

[00:52:22] fox go bread in and intercepted

[00:52:24] the attack

[00:52:26] yeah you're right it would come back and then

[00:52:28] reform

[00:52:30] well you know

[00:52:32] it's not that satisfying

[00:52:34] but there's something in all these

[00:52:36] missing pieces

[00:52:38] oh that's what we were told

[00:52:40] how this ends

[00:52:42] it's not that sad

[00:52:44] yeah I don't know John said we can get answers

[00:52:46] to our questions but they won't necessarily

[00:52:48] be the answers we want

[00:52:50] I don't know I'm not gonna set my

[00:52:52] expectations below

[00:52:54] yeah I keep grabbing seriously

[00:52:56] also another thing I was thinking is

[00:52:58] did we see

[00:53:00] Tonks in the resurrection stone

[00:53:02] is there a chance she's alive

[00:53:04] I don't think we saw her just because she's not

[00:53:06] she's not as important to Harry

[00:53:08] to Harry yeah

[00:53:10] so did Harry get to choose who popped up

[00:53:12] who was it again

[00:53:14] subconsciously chose yeah yeah just like

[00:53:16] the people most important

[00:53:18] serious that's right

[00:53:20] they were all friends though too

[00:53:22] yeah like

[00:53:26] I don't know if that's true

[00:53:28] maybe an outlier but

[00:53:34] the abandoned boys had all found a home here

[00:53:38] everyone from that great died

[00:53:42] everyone's dying in this one

[00:53:44] look at that

[00:53:46] it's like this chapter is kind of like

[00:53:48] Harry's a cursed guy walking

[00:53:50] toward his death it's like everyone who

[00:53:52] interacts with Harry is cursed so

[00:53:54] it's like will some people meet

[00:53:56] their demise in the next

[00:53:58] new chapter

[00:54:00] will more people die

[00:54:02] which is just a little devastating

[00:54:04] of a point which is yeah Jen why do you think

[00:54:06] the sacrifice is going to be

[00:54:08] covering those people

[00:54:10] exactly then they can't die

[00:54:12] that's how they can defeat everybody

[00:54:14] because Harry's love protection

[00:54:16] is their shield

[00:54:18] what if he dies and then he comes back

[00:54:20] but how would you do that

[00:54:22] cause he's not real

[00:54:24] cause he's not real

[00:54:26] hello

[00:54:28] he defeated death

[00:54:30] isn't that like inception

[00:54:32] or whatever that movie

[00:54:34] it was all in his head

[00:54:36] it was all in his head

[00:54:38] do you imagine if the whole

[00:54:40] in 30 years is really all in Harry's head

[00:54:42] he wakes up he's under the

[00:54:44] cupboard he's still 11

[00:54:46] and all that would be

[00:54:48] crazy and then Dudley's

[00:54:50] just banging on the door giving him a hard time

[00:54:52] all the books were a dream

[00:54:54] and then he pulled out

[00:54:56] that would be a very sad dream

[00:54:58] I don't think I know that song

[00:55:00] do I know that song

[00:55:02] they both probably don't know

[00:55:04] before our time huh

[00:55:06] it starts with it was all a dream

[00:55:08] if you don't know

[00:55:10] it was all a dream

[00:55:12] yeah

[00:55:14] it's a biggie song

[00:55:16] I was singing it

[00:55:18] but no one heard

[00:55:20] except for you

[00:55:22] I heard it it just doesn't mean anything to me

[00:55:24] it could have been a song you were making up

[00:55:26] I don't know

[00:55:28] I'm famous then

[00:55:32] alright give me

[00:55:34] I mean Harry's

[00:55:36] probably our favorite character in this chapter

[00:55:38] the Hatsumali in this chapter

[00:55:40] do you have a favorite moment

[00:55:42] in this chapter at least

[00:55:44] unless you have different ones for this as well

[00:55:46] his mom and him were

[00:55:48] cute yeah

[00:55:50] he was great mom

[00:55:52] brave

[00:55:54] I think it's sweet that he had

[00:55:56] people to walk with him

[00:55:58] to

[00:56:00] his not death but yeah

[00:56:04] it's gonna be when you guys

[00:56:06] go through your second read it's gonna be interesting

[00:56:08] the way this chapter is

[00:56:10] written it's just such good writing

[00:56:12] so like every line just has so much

[00:56:14] meaning to it and so much like

[00:56:16] importance and it just everything leads

[00:56:18] to this some of the lines in this

[00:56:20] chapter and when you re-read it

[00:56:22] you're like you really

[00:56:24] appreciate how good of a writer she is

[00:56:26] for squeezing so much like

[00:56:28] meaning into some of these lines it's fantastic

[00:56:32] so what are we missing

[00:56:34] the read between the lines now

[00:56:36] all the things that we'll pick up on our next read

[00:56:38] what did I miss in my second

[00:56:40] read a lot

[00:56:46] yeah I think my favorite moment is the one

[00:56:48] with Lily and the Harry

[00:56:50] two just like looking at each other and they

[00:56:52] can't get enough it's just such a devastating

[00:56:54] moment and I guess Harry's

[00:56:56] just the favorite character yeah

[00:56:58] are there any Hatsumali's in this one

[00:57:00] it's the whole culmination of the books

[00:57:02] Harry's got it in this one yep

[00:57:04] I guess Hagrid is a little bit of a Hatsumali

[00:57:06] yeah he's standing up for Harry

[00:57:10] well thanks for joining us on this journey

[00:57:12] of Harry Potter and the First-Time Readers

[00:57:14] music

[00:57:30] no reading Jen

[00:57:32] I'm not reading it

[00:57:34] I'm reading the last page

[00:57:36] refreshing memory

[00:57:38] the boy who's

[00:57:40] I was reading between the lines

[00:57:42] yeah

[00:57:44] all the more it says

[00:57:46] all right

[00:57:48] music

[00:57:54] music